Kawi2strokes.com Forum

Back to basics........ finer threads move less per rotation, finer threads take less torque to turn. All aftermarket mechanisms have finer threads for less torque (lighter feel) so none will give the same range of movement of a stocker.

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Twist the throttle, tilt the horizon, and have a great time. What triples are all about...........

Yes Moo is right they have all other threads. But ours has also another thread than the Sytech. We tested a lot and it works alos in many modified engines.
Rick Brett also rides it in his drag engine in SPA 2 years ago and it works fine. Many modified engines are running fine with it. I take it also in my motorcycle shop, which I have nearly since 3 years now, and always with one package more of steel plate and fiber plate in every engine I rebuild and never had a problem with it. The Sytech I tested many years ago on my own bike (H1 with some mods) doesn't work perfect. Because I had always problems with the first gear and so on. That's why we take another thread.

Regards
Ralf

I noticed that you used a square thread on your actuator Ralf, good call!
It's the most efficient thread for a screw drive.

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http://kawatriple.com/wtf/

Ralf, the only modification I would suggest is to make the cable mount clevis point adjustable, closer, or farther away from the rotational center, so different mechanical advantages can be utilized for different clutch packs, stock pack, added plate, etc. That way, the user can mod as needed to allow the release to work spot on with all the variations of clutch setups.

Ride Report:
72 H2; extra plates, .030" taken off basket, H1 steels (I think), 5 Barnett springs
This bike has never had a problem going into first gear

With Sytec:
Putting bike in first gear = clunk sound, bike want to pull forward , idle drops - Clearly not a full disengagement

With Stocker (Metal spine, nylon housing)
NO clunk going into first gear when warm, idle barely drops and does not want to pull forward - Much greater disengagement
It shifts slightly better although it shifted just fine with Sytec
Down shifting is amazing; normally i am headed down a 2 lane road between 30-40, make a quick right, pull in clutch and kill engine while clicking down from 2nd to neutral. It didn't like to downshift with the engine off and me doing a jig on the shifter; MUCH better with stocker. This allows me to coast into the neighborhood for about 150 yards in silence into the driveway to keep the peace.

I'm thinking that the Barnett's are just more spring than I need.
Leo had mentioned that Larry Smith has taller springs with a slightly higher pre-tension and then moderate pressure.
Apparently this spring with a ball bearing pusher (and modified plates) has worked well for some.

Edit: Oh yeah; the lever is harder to pull and wonder how long the nylon housing will last with monster springs

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There are only two types of motor sport racing:
Nitro and everything else
(Sometimes referred to as fast and slow)

I am running one of the diablocycle sytech replica clutch actuators on my S3a. It works fine for me.
HOWEVER, I have the later style KH? handgrips installed that are a smaller diameter than the early grips that came from the factory. Possibly the smaller diameter gives just enough extra throw to allow it to work?

JimC,

For my almost H2R ported street H2, with good pipes, offset over bored to 39.6mm carbs, "With Stocker (Metal spine, nylon housing)" (street bike release, 2nd design) with cable clevis hole moved 5mm's for more mechanical advantage, extra plate clutch (stock friction/steel plates, street bike H2 clutch cable, on clip-on's, Yamaha RD350 two bolt mount clutch lever, and a full set of 5 Barnett springs, NO slip, NO drag, NO clunk, and, the lever pressure/resistance was quite acceptable.

I did the same mods to the H2R release's, used the release you mentioned, with my cable lever clevis move, Kawasaki lever on the bars, H2R cable (120mm's shorter than street bike), and full H2R dry clutch, same results, but, H2R clutches were easy to pull in in the first place, so, they worked with two fingers that way.

Just what we did eons ago, that seems to work today...still.

The new super releases need a slot for the cable lever to be adjusted in or out from the center of the release, to adjust for the type clutch used. They work, but need more leverage ratio adjustment, not a bad deal, just need a little more.

Best stock cable releases I have seen are the three ball bearing Yamaha ones, but, they need different length/angle ramps for clutches that need more release movement, as their ramps are fairly shallow.

This whole thing started with a low mile original H1D that had a clutch that would slip when it came on the pipe; all the stock parts were perfect but would not lock up regardless of the gear lube; even tried the Sta Lube you mentioned years ago.
A few Barnett springs fixed that problem.

When I went throughout the H2 I disassembled and decided it would have some mods.
Found my log book and sure enough I took .030" of the basket; used H1 steels, Versah fibers, and checked everything for flatness against my "surface plate" (a thick piece of glass and the granite counter tops in the kitchen). I thought if I was in it this deep, I'd go with the Sytec and use 5 barnet springs.

I'm starting to like the hard clutch pull and how the stock actuator releases.
I just bought a ball bearing unit form a board member to see how that feels; I'm assuming the reduction of mechanical resistance might lighten the pull.

Dave, have you tried any springs that are beefier than stock but as strong as Barnets?

For a reasonably stock bike with chambers, I think I meet be at overkill with big springs; also thinking I can reduce wear and stress on parts like cables and actuators with a lighter spring.

Haven't found this spring although the Redline springs might be just right.

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There are only two types of motor sport racing:
Nitro and everything else
(Sometimes referred to as fast and slow)

I like Barnett plates with stock springs, but I seem to be in the minority. Yes, swelling, but the hydraulic actuator makes that irrelevant.

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If it surges, that's normal, upshift.

JimC, I like the Barnett springs, hate their friction plates. I got to like the Barnett 5 spring "pull", let me know I had a real clutch in the bike. I haven't found a better spring than the Barnett for a wet H series clutch.

There used to be a company in Washington state, Metal Frictions, that had GREAT friction plates, but haven't seen them around for a decade. The VESRAH plates are what I use now, they are top notch parts.

"I just bought a ball bearing unit form a board member to see how that feels; I'm assuming the reduction of mechanical resistance might lighten the pull." I NEVER did like the all ball bearing pushers, they just didn't seem as good as the 6 spiral ones, but, they don't break like the nylon spirals do.

What we are dealing with here is the leverage ratios from a variety of different combinations from levers, to releases. A bit of "math and massaging" will get any clutch package working correctly, just have to know what is going on as you go, and adjust from there.

The Sytec, Ralf's and other specialty releases are top notch stuff, but, as with most things, there is more to do, as I said, the leverage ratios might just have to be "modified" for best actuation. Case in point, it was mentioned that some specialty releases have a finer spiral angle than other releases, and don't push as far, but a lot easier. Well, the "fix" would be to carefully select the lever assembly for the handlebar, that allows more cable pull, then, change the cable holder clevis pin location on the release lever, to gain a longer pull. that is basically what I have been outlining. It is all trial and error, readjust, but, once right, the harshest clutch can be tamed right down to work efficiently.

The original design had no room for modification to the wet clutch, the H series racers were specifically different, but designed for the stock leverage ratio releases. They usually worked flawlessly for stock applications, after they were adjusted correctly, but, tht was usually NEVER done at new bike setu, nor at first service, unless the clutch was so off,m it didn't work in the first place. The factory never did adjust much, they simply assembled, made run, packed and shipped, with the task of adjusting correctly given to dealer mechanics that had no clue mostly. I adjusted all the clutches I ever saw when I worked at dealerships, because others previously, DIDN'T.

You guys have a lot of good ideas, go play with 'em, it'll fix 'em.

The hydraulic release setups, when sized right (correcting the leverage ratio of the release push) makes them equally as good as any there are.

We used to adjust the clutches on Chevy race cars by having a helper hold the clutch pedal down, and adjusting the friction plate clearance from pressure plate to flywheel to .055/.060 inch, with a feeler gauge. If we couldn't get that out of the setup, we'd change the release fork, cross shaft, whatever it took to get the setting correct, and the clutches worked fantastic.